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Yup, it sure is all very confusing. Which highlights my point that at some level we're all very closely connected genetically no matter where we live. The argument made by those researchers I mentioned earlier is that most people of European origin seem to have common ancestors only 1,000 years ago. If you go 3-4,000 years ago you'll certainly find connections and common ancestry with people from Africa or who know from where else.
Trying to define one's ethnic identity based on genes is a futile exercise. Our gene pool is so messed up that even though certain ethnic groups do have some common traits and share more common genes than others, if you look at the bigger picture (and depending how far back in time one is willing to go) you'll find that we're all brothers and sisters sharing common ancestry not as far back as one would have thought.
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Close in what sense? Genetically or culturally?
Genetically you're most likely pretty close to them knowing full well that Greece (and Asia Minor) was invaded at various time by Romans, various Germanic tribes, later Venetians, Spaniards, Brits, Italians, French etc. and who knows who else in between.
Especially the invasions/migrations of the Germanic tribes in the area of modern day Greece and Turkey between the 2nd and 5th centuries are well documented. Here's a map I found with a quick search, but I'm sure you can find much more info if you google about this:
This article of course talks about genetics, not culture. Culture is a different question all together.
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I don't think it matter how many is "many". It could be just a handful for all it matters.
The argument still stands that this is still a really small world after all, and most of us are connected and share the genes one way or another.
I was under the impression that this connection would be going back to maybe 4,000 - 5,000 years but if it's only 1,000 years or less this makes the argument even stronger and makes the argument of different races and ethnic groups even more stupid.
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What makes you say that? Nature is one of the top publications of its kind.
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This article doesn't make much sense to me either, but seeing that it's written by a German professor of economics with pretty strong credentials I'm assuming that he knows much more than I do around global finances.
Either way, the next couple of weeks are going to be critical for Greece and for Europe.
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Read'em and weep Merkel
Varoufakis’s Great Game
By Hans-Werner Sinn
Hans-Werner Sinn, Professor of Economics and Public Finance at the University of Munich, is President of the Ifo Institute for Economic Research and serves on the German economy ministry’s Advisory Council. He is the author, most recently, of The Euro Trap: On Bursting Bubbles, Budgets and Beliefs.
MUNICH – Game theorists know that a Plan A is never enough. One must also develop and put forward a credible Plan B – the implied threat that drives forward negotiations on Plan A. Greece’s finance minister, Yanis Varoufakis, knows this very well. As the Greek government’s anointed “heavy,” he is working Plan B (a potential exit from the eurozone), while Prime Minister Alexis Tsipras makes himself available for Plan A (an extension on Greece’s loan agreement, and a renegotiation of the terms of its bailout). In a sense, they are playing the classic game of “good cop/bad cop” – and, so far, to great effect.Plan B comprises two key elements. First, there is simple provocation, aimed at riling up Greek citizens and thus escalating tensions between the country and its creditors. Greece’s citizens must believe that they are escaping grave injustice if they are to continue to trust their government during the difficult period that would follow an exit from the eurozone.
Second, the Greek government is driving up the costs of Plan B for the other side, by allowing capital flight by its citizens. If it so chose, the government could contain this trend with a more conciliatory approach, or stop it outright with the introduction of capital controls. But doing so would weaken its negotiating position, and that is not an option.
Capital flight does not mean that capital is moving abroad in net terms, but rather that private capital is being turned into public capital. Basically, Greek citizens take out loans from local banks, funded largely by the Greek central bank, which acquires funds through the European Central Bank’s emergency liquidity assistance (ELA) scheme. They then transfer the money to other countries to purchase foreign assets (or redeem their debts), draining liquidity from their country’s banks.
Other eurozone central banks are thus forced to create new money to fulfill the payment orders for the Greek citizens, effectively giving the Greek central bank an overdraft credit, as measured by the so-called Target liabilities. In January and February, Greece’s TARGET debts increased by almost €1 billion ($1.1 billion) per day, owing to capital flight by Greek citizens and foreign investors. At the end of April, those debts amounted to €99 billion.
A Greek exit would not damage the accounts that its citizens have set up in other eurozone countries – let alone cause Greeks to lose the assets they have purchased with those accounts. But it would leave those countries’ central banks stuck with Greek citizens’ euro-denominated TARGET claims vis-à-vis Greece’s central bank, which would have assets denominated only in a restored drachma. Given the new currency’s inevitable devaluation, together with the fact that the Greek government does not have to backstop its central bank’s debt, a default depriving the other central banks of their claims would be all but certain.
A similar situation arises when Greek citizens withdraw cash from their accounts and hoard it in suitcases or take it abroad. If Greece abandoned the euro, a substantial share of these funds – which totaled €43 billion at the end of April – would flow into the rest of the eurozone, both to purchase goods and assets and to pay off debts, resulting in a net loss for the monetary union’s remaining members.
All of this strengthens the Greek government’s negotiating position considerably. Small wonder, then, that Varoufakis and Tsipras are playing for time, refusing to submit a list of meaningful reform proposals.
The ECB bears considerable responsibility for this situation. By failing to produce the two-thirds majority in the ECB Council needed to limit the Greek central bank’s self-serving strategy, it has allowed the creation of more than €80 billion in emergency liquidity, which exceeds the Greek central bank’s €41 billion in recoverable assets. With Greece’s banks guaranteed the needed funds, the government has been spared from having to introduce capital controls.
Rumor has it that the ECB is poised to adjust its approach – and soon. It knows that its argument that the ELA loans are collateralized is wearing thin, given that, in many cases, the collateral has a rating below BBB-, thus falling short of investment grade.
If the ECB finally acknowledges that this will not do, and removes Greece’s liquidity safety net, the Greek government would be forced to start negotiating seriously, because waiting would no longer do it any good. But, with the stock of money sent abroad and held in cash having already ballooned to 79% of GDP, its position would remain very strong.
In other words, thanks largely to the ECB, the Greek government would be able to secure a far more favorable outcome – including increased financial assistance and reduced reform requirements – than it could have gained at any point in the past. A large share of the acquired resources measured by the TARGET balances and the cash that has been printed would turn into an endowment gift for an independent future.
Many people in Europe seem to believe that Varoufakis, an experienced game theorist but a political neophyte, does not know how to play the cards that Greece has been dealt. They should think again – before Greece walks away with the pot.
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Well Admin,
Invite a couple of Muslim, Jewish and Hindu friends over and serve beef wrapped in bacon and smothered in butter. Don't forget to have a few beers on ice. Enjoy!
As I said, these are all related to religious beliefs. I do have a few Palestinian, Lebanese, Iranian, Afghani and Jewish friends who do eat beef, pork, seafood, you name it. Oh yes, they also drink alcohol and smoke too. We've had many a nights where we ate, drank and had a few cigars too. There's nothing in these people's cultures that stops them from enjoying all this. It's religion which places this type of stupid rules.
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Eyo, you're describing issues arising because of religious differences, not because of cultural differences. Granted of course than in many cases religion is part of a people's cultural identity. Since most religions are so rigid they make it impossible for certain people to live in peace next to each other (see for example Jews and Palestinians).
Saying this though, Jews and Palestinians live fine next to each other within a multicultural society (in Canada for example).
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In a grander scheme, yes. I personally don't believe in borders and national territories. This world should belong to every human being who lives on this earth and we should all be free to travel anywhere in the world without having to worry about borders and nationalities. To me saying I'm a Greek national or a Canadian national doesn't mean anything. I'm Greek because culturally I associate myself with the Greek culture.
Of course I also understand today's reality and I understand that the majority of people is not ready to accept a global community without borders. Thankfully I live in a society (Canada) which is the closest we've ever been to multiculturalism. Eventually the rest of the countries will have to learn, adapt and accept this reality.
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These types of oaths? Sure they are. They're remnants of times when people's lives "belonged" to kings and queens. Is any of this relevant in today's day and age?
Oaths are made by people who are afraid that their power will, at some point, be challenged. Like kings and queens, military leaders, dictators and so on.
An oath is not the same things as your word to an individual whom you know and respect. Is your oath to respect and obey your military leaders while in the Greek army as powerful (and relevant) as your word to a buddy of yours to help him build a fence or repair his house or whatever?
Oaths are enforced to you (and to the average individual) by those in power and by the power of the groupthink. They don't mean anything to most people anymore, yet we still take those oaths as we still eat lamb for easter and turkey for Christmas.
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It depends. If the world wants to believe and pledge allegiance to kings and queens and gods, who am I to break their bubble? Do I have to believe in that too? No.
My word means a lot to those who are relevant.
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I assume you took the Canadian oath of citizenship:
I swear (or affirm) that I will be faithful and bear true allegiance to Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth II, Queen of Canada, Her Heirs and Successors, and that I will faithfully observe the laws of Canada and fulfil my duties as a Canadian citizen.
So let me ask you,
do you bear true alligiance to your Queen?
The very same Queen who had "Your Cypriot Brothers" Palikarides, Karaolis and Dimitriou hanged?
How do you deal with your Macedonian-Canadian compatriots?
Are you preaching the Greek mantra to them? Or do you denigrate them by questioning the Macedonian part of their identity?
Or perhaps you dont take your oath seriously?
I do not believe in kings and queens, so that part of the oath doesn't mean anything to me, but I do faithfully observe the laws of Canada and fulfill my duties as a Canadian citizen.
I assume that as a Greek citizen you also faithfully observe the laws of Greece and fulfill your duties as a Greek citizen
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Do you need to be an official "citizen" of a place in order to "pledge allegiance" to it (whatever this means - and I'd assume that it would mean different things to different people).
I've lived most (if not all...) of my adult life outside Greece. Even though I've kept my Greek citizenship I do not really participate in Greek elections (as I'm assuming that you're not participating either) and I haven't been part of electing Greek officials. Yet, I still love Greece and I consider it to be my home, more so than I consider Canada my home. At the same time, I love and respect Canada and Canadians (and I'm a dual Greek/Canadian citizen).
Do I ever call myself Canadian? Barely ever.
Am I really a Canadian national? On paper yes, I am. But am I really a Canadian national? I don't think so... Even though based on my lifestyle most Greeks would most likely see me as a Canadian/American I will never really become a "true" Canadian national because I'll always remain Greek at heart.
Canada is my adopted country, and as you said, a few years down the road I may be living in Japan or Sweden or wherever and call that my adopted country. Would I ever call my self Canadian or Japanese or Swedish? Not really.
Would I love and pledge allegiance to my adopted country? Absolutely. If I chose to live somewhere for whatever reasons (be it financial reasons, or because I appreciate their political system, or because I like their culture etc.) then I become a part of the mosaic which defines any country I live in.
I love Canada and Greece equally. Even though I chose Canada to be my home (while it was just luck of the draw that I was born Greek), I still have a special place in my heart for Greece. No matter how many years I live away from her Greece will always be home to me.
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They're laughable...
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Vancouver is a beautiful city, but it's not Athens (in terms of the nightlife) by any stretch of the imagination.
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I thought to share this in this post, as we talked in here about European/Greek/German etc. ancestry. I guess we're all related one way or the other
Read here: http://www.nature.com/news/most-europeans-share-recent-ancestors-1.12950 and also more info and answers to many common questions here: http://gcbias.org/european-genealogy-faq/
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Are you serious? You're comparing Vancouver's nightlife to Athens'?
You're in for a surprise.
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Henis all hot air and has zero competence. He is openly called incompetent from other finance ministers. He gives boring lectures and interviews and does not work much.
I'd say the opposite about his lectures and interviews. He's usually very interesting and direct (unlike most other politicians). He also seems to work very hard these days to make things happen for Greece, what makes you think that he doesn't work much? That's a very unjust stereotype attached to all Greeks.
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Very interesting interview of Yanis Varoufakis at the New York Times Magazine. I'd encourage to read through it if you have time (it's pretty long...).
Here's an interesting piece:
“There’s no doubt that this economy now is far worse off in the last two months as a result of our hard bargaining.”
He described that change as a trade-off, an investment in a better future.
“And an investment always involves a short-term cost,” he said.
I asked him about that short-term cost. Is he worried about the Greek economy today?
Terrified,” he said. “Terrified and aghast.”http://www.nytimes.com/2015/05/24/magazine/a-finance-minister-fit-for-a-greek-tragedy.html?_r=0
Even though I lately came to doubt Yanis I still cannot not like him. He's a character and he seems and sounds honest. I do believe that he got involved with all this because he truly believed that he could help Greece out of this mess.
What I find hard to reconcile with is that after 4 months of Syriza in power Greece is in a worse negotiating position as compared to where we were 4 months earlier. To me this shows that Syriza (and Yanis as the finance minister) were very poorly prepared to face the Europeans. They had no clear plan or clear fresh ideas to suggest and they've been wasting precious time since. As it is right now Greece is a few short days from bankruptcy and at the complete mercy of the Europeans. It's completely up to them at this point whether they'll pull the plug and let Greece out of the Euro. The Greek government (Syriza) has absolutely no say in this decision anymore. They're just waiting for the Europeans' next move and hoping for the best.
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Fear and Anger?
Bullshit. But you lack objectivity. That much is clear. All your idiotic posts about "The Greeks Genious" prove that much.
The only thing that Genious has produced is Greek statistics. Just face it Greeks are "Order Takers" who lack the capacity to be creative. But the best part in your post was the mention of that infamous "Filotimo".
Well buddy, go visit a mental institution in Greece or a facility for handicapped and you'll see how far that filotimo goes.
No need for personal attacks ajax.
I never liked generalization of any kind, be it positive or negative. As you can't say that all Greeks posses what we call "filotimo" the same way you can't say that all Greeks are "order takers" (whatever this means...).
In fact, if anything - and maybe this is what has brought Greece to this situation today - is that Greeks, in general, are not order takers. We're individualists to a fault. Which means that more often than not we do not follow orders, even if those orders are to our benefit. To me this is a negative trait we have as a people. Our individualism and love for (what we perceive as) individual freedom leads many Greeks do all those things that are wrong with the Greek society today (ex. parking illegally wherever we want, throw garbage anywhere we want, disregard of our fellow citizen rights as long as our rights are served etc.).
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I pretty sure evryone loves his home. Let me show mine and i can tell you i feel exactly same about germany.
Absolutely. Most people love the place they were born and raised. That's a given.
What makes Greece special is that many people who were not born and raised in Greece develop a special and close connection to her.
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This is exactly it. There's no perfect place (or country) anywhere in the world. Greece has a very ugly side (when it comes to government related services mainly...) but it also has a wonderful side as well.
For my part, I love most of the people I associate with when I visit Greece. Friends, relatives or random people I meet in the streets. Most of them are great human beings and I love spending time with them. Most of all I love the land. I've visited many wonderful places in my lifetime (so far...), and I've lived in a few places outside Greece, but no matter where I've been Greece is always in my heart and it always feels like home whenever I visit. I don't think this will ever change.
Sure, the Greece I knew as a child and teenager has changed, so what? It's still beautiful for what it is. The feeling I get when I sit down in some coffee place in Greece, grab a cup of coffee and look at the sea is priceless. I've done the same in the most wonderful places, like Hawaii for example, but it just doesn't feel the same. Even my wife, who's not Greek, says the same thing. No matter where we've been, in the most wonderful places, nowhere feels like Greece. There's something in this land which makes it so much sweeter being there.
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Well said Dino (about the show too
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daman, please no more personal attacks. Let's end it here.
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Jen, is this you? Our Jen?