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Dino

Time Out: Let's Stop the Blame Game in Europe

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Not happy on how things have worked out since the election, but he makes some very valid points, even if he is doing what we call here in the states "Monday night quarterbacking" 

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What baffles me is how this guy finds time to write articles (and do photo shoots...) in the middle of a crisis, and in the middle of constantly travelling around Europe to persuade the rest of the EU to keep Greece in the Euro.

I had high hopes when he took up office, but a few weeks later I'm realizing that I've never seen a showboating individual like this one in the Greek political scene ever before.

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I just want good results, sometimes doing what he is, can create positive PR, it is easier to listen to and like an outgoing person, the problem is I am not seeing enough good results/moves from him or Tsipras.

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Guest PatrickT

Times for talking are pretty much over and we close in the endgame. Commentators here in germany expect first the GREXIT followed by the GREXITUS.

 

Large parts of the german people are sick of this entire topic and there is little to zero sympathy for greece left. Commentators even say Merkel wasted more time dealing with greece than doing dealing with german problems.

 

In a way i´m happy for the "syriza" government. Because they finally end this farce. The reform list greece send to the EU is laughable at best and nobody will accept this. 

 

Greece is only a small country and thinks it can fool the entire EU. This is not just germany here. Not one east european EU country like slovakia or poland agree to more help and money for greece. Greece recent hate rants against germany, spain, portugal and italy doesn´t help either. Varoufakis is basicly a dead duck and has lost any authority in the EU. 

 

The effects of a GREXIT would be minimal. The greek economy is small. It has the size of the economy of Stuttgart. That basicly means a single german city has more economic power than entire greece. Portugal, Spain, Ireland and Italy got stabilized in the last years and months an i think in the end it will be best for both sides.

 

As the President of the german federal bank Jens Weidenmüller said, Greece is not a functional nation. It has the executive and legislative structure of a typical 3rd world nation. 

 

Greece can´t be kicked out of the € and EU by law but would be forced out simply because its bancruptcy. At April 9th greece must pay a large tranch back to the IWF. If this money doesn´t come, then greece is official bancrupt.

 

It looks like greece will be unable to pay it back and as it looks now they will not get an further money from the EU. The ECB even banned greek banks to buy greek bonds. 

 

As i said the effects on the EU will be very small and almost zero for germany. We have our economy running hot in a record boom. The stocks reached a new hight here, income is on a record high as well as exports and we have almost zero unemployment. So i see no problem. This is not against the greek people but there comes a moment when you must face reality. Chancellor Merkel is elected as leader of germany and it is her 1st duty to do the best for our nation. her 2nd duty is to do the best for the EU ad greece simply comes at the very end of this list. 

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Guest eyoismos

 

Large parts of the german people are sick of this entire topic and there is little to zero sympathy for greece left.

 

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Guest eyoismos

i refer you back to the article from the huffington ...
 

First, the new loans did not represent a bailout for Greece so much as a cynical transfer of private losses from the banks' books onto the shoulders of Greece's most vulnerable citizens. How many of Europe's taxpayers, who have footed the bill for these loans, know that more than 90 percent of the €240 billion ($260 billion) that Greece borrowed went to financial institutions, not to the Greek state or its people?

Second, it was obvious that if Greece already could not repay its existing loans, the austerity conditions on which the "bailouts" were premised would crush Greek nominal incomes, making the national debt even less sustainable. When Greeks could no longer make payments on their mountainous debts, German and other European taxpayers would have to step in again. (Wealthy Greeks, of course, had already shifted their deposits to financial centers like Frankfurt and London.)

Finally, misleading peoples and parliaments by presenting a bank bailout as an act of "solidarity," while failing to help ordinary Greeks -- indeed, setting them up to place an even heavier burden on Germans -- was destined to undermine cohesion within the eurozone. Germans turned against Greeks; Greeks turned against Germans; and, as more countries have faced fiscal hardship, Europe has turned against itself.

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Guest eyoismos

not that what you said doesnt bare some validity.... far from it ... it does, and very much so ... but the problem is ...its only partial and nowhere near the whole reality

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Guest eyoismos

 

Greece recent hate rants against germany, spain, portugal and italy

 

??????

 

say that again again ?

 

focus.jpg

 

bild.jpg

 

 

i wont ever bother with a whole lot more ... not even about merkel's speeches about greeks being lazy etc

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Guest PatrickT

The basic problem is, that greece did never fit into the EU nor did it ever fullfill the obligations to do so. That it entered EU and € was a mistake. And mistakes should be corrected. 

 

Tsipras wants that the Eu basicly pays greece party with EU citizens tax money. We already prepare for the GREXIt and i´m sure any european central bank does. The ECB claims otherwise but its happening. The weakest part in this is Lagarde and her IWF. She must not face any election, so she is used as a lightening rod to trigger the implosion. 

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Guest eyoismos

The basic problem is, that greece did never fit into the EU nor did it ever fullfill the obligations to do so. That it entered EU and € was a mistake. And mistakes should be corrected.

 

Tsipras wants that the Eu basicly pays greece party with EU citizens tax money. We already prepare for the GREXIt and i´m sure any european central bank does. The ECB claims otherwise but its happening. The weakest part in this is Lagarde and her IWF. She must not face any election, so she is used as a lightening rod to trigger the implosion.

Luke 6:42

How can you say to your brother, 'Brother, let me take the speck out of your eye,' when you yourself fail to see the plank in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother's eye

 

THAT !!!! is the basic problem

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Guest PatrickT

??????

 

say that again again ?

 

focus.jpg

 

bild.jpg

 

 

i wont ever bother with a whole lot more ... not even about merkel's speeches about greeks being lazy etc

 

Greece openly flirts with our enemy russia. Greece threatens to allow ISIS terrorists into the EU. Thats not how a civilized nation behaves in my opinion. Thats far worse than rants or media articles. Thats not against the greek people but i believe there is a time where you must accept a mistake and correct it. 

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Guest eyoismos

Greece openly flirts with our enemy russia. Greece threatens to allow ISIS terrorists into the EU. Thats not how a civilized nation behaves in my opinion. Thats far worse than rants or media articles. Thats not against the greek people but i believe there is a time where you must accept a mistake and correct it. 

 

Greece threatens to allow ISIS terrorists into the EU ??? holly fuck !!! some douchebag says something stupid and moronic and all of a sudden GREECE said it

 

but wait i forget .... merkel said greeks are lazy and thieves and what not ... so because merkel said it ... its true

 

Greece openly flirts with our enemy russia? uhm .... run that past me again ? .... its ok for germany to meet up with russia and china and all the rest .... to protect herself and expand trade and all the rest .... but if greece dares to do that ... for the same reasons .... major sin .... chop off her head

 

but then the real joke is ....germany is quite happy to sell arms to just about anybody .... lets say ... the saudis ... with their incredible human right record ... after all its good economic trade and policy

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Guest PatrickT
 

Greece threatens to allow ISIS terrorists into the EU ??? holly fuck !!! some douchebag says something stupid and moronic and all of a sudden GREECE said it

 

but wait i forget .... merkel said greeks are lazy and thieves and what not ... so because merkel said it ... its true

 

Greece openly flirts with our enemy russia? uhm .... run that past me again ? .... its ok for germany to meet up with russia and china and all the rest .... to protect herself and expand trade and all the rest .... but if greece dares to do that ... for the same reasons .... major sin .... chop off her head

 

 

This douchebag is the greek defense minister. What he says must be the official stand of the greek govrnment then.

 

Chancellor Merkel never called the greeks thieves or lazy. She suggested them to work harder. Which i assume would be a positive thing. 

 

I honestly would like to know what greece expects us to do? To pay its debt? This won´t happen. 

 

There must be new ideas to deal with this. Greece already sold us someof its airports, which is a positive first step. Another idea could be that it sells some of its islands. If i remember right there were some aegean islands who wished to leave greece and become part of germany.

 

It is a solution we could support. Sell some islands, art and such national assets to germany and in return we pay some of greece debt. nother solution is impossible. Keep in mind that each program must be supported from our Bundestag and the german public demands to see something in return. 

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Guest eyoismos

by the way ...  i am just curious .... what was the areas of comment that the, as you call it "leftist cabarett", brought about ....that is wholely incorrect and totally of the mark of PART of the truth?

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by the way ...  i am just curious .... what was the areas of comment that the, as you call it "leftist cabarett", brought about ....that is wholely incorrect and totally of the mark of PART of the truth?

 

I did not watch it. But i know "Die Anstalt". They are considered leftist. 

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Guest eyoismos

 

Chancellor Merkel never called the greeks thieves or lazy

 

guess again

 

https://euobserver.com/political/32363

 

http://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/the-myth-of-a-lazy-southern-europe-merkel-s-cliches-debunked-by-statistics-a-763618.html

 

 

OECD data show that in 2008, Greeks worked on average 2120 hours a year. That is 690 hours more than the average German and 467 more than the average Brit. Only Koreans work longer hours. The paid leave entitlement in Greece is on average 23 days, lower than the UK’s minimum 28 and Germany’s whopping 30.

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Guest eyoismos

I did not watch it. But i know "Die Anstalt". They are considered leftist. 

so what if it is leftist? are you suggesting that only "rightist" is on the money ...excuse the pun

 

but i suppose that you didnt watch it because it is "leftist" therefore all lies

 

dont get me wrong .... the so called left is very much guilty of a whole lot of bullshit .... but then again .... so is the right, unless you consider the right total angels and beyond approach ... in which case i fold my cards even though i might have a royal flush in my hands

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Guest eyoismos

 

This douchebag is the greek defense minister. What he says must be the official stand of the greek govrnment then

 

remind me again please about how he got that position, and what kind of % he got from the greek elections?

 

its called "politicing" and by nature is dirty ... and for your information, the vast majority of the greeks where not happy with his ranting and raving

 

but then germany must surly not  have their little "gems" of their own ...after all ... they are all flawless from sin

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Guest PatrickT

remind me again please about how he got that position, and what kind of % he got from the greek elections?

 

its called "politicing" and by nature is dirty ... and for your information, the vast majority of the greeks where not happy with his ranting and raving

 

but then germany must surly not  have their little "gems" of their own ...after all ... they are all flawless from sin

Germany would not threaten to send terrorists into greece. Making a coalition with this nazi party was a bad move from Tsipras.

 

But you did not answer me. What do you expect from germany? To pay greek bills? I dont understand what exactly greece wants. And what we get in return?

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Guest eyoismos

as i said, she did mot say "lazy" or thieves. Thats not the words she would chose.

semantics

 

a rose, by any other name, is still a rose but with the thorns it can be used as a weapon

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Guest eyoismos

coalition with this nazi party

 

at least get your facts straight ....

 

 Kammenos is the founder of the right-wing anti-austerity party "Independent Greeks"

 

you my friend have fallen victim of Godwin's law and in danger of losing any arguments you might bring up in any conversation or debate

 

but kammenos is still a wanker... a patriotic one, ....maybe.....but a wanker never the less

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Calm down guys. Mistakes have been done on both sides. Both Greece and the EU are in a situation now where a viable solution needs to be found. Time is running out.

Either way, even if Greece exits Euro I don't think this is going to be the end of Greece or the end of the EU.

 

Greece has find herself in tougher situations than this. We'll somehow find a way to make this work.

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Guest eyoismos

What do you expect from germany?

 

at the very least recognize and pay for its own sins, especially of hypocrisy

 

siemens, ThyssenKrupp and many other comes to mind ...along with many other companies and individuals , INCLUDING the totally unholy government practices, political, economic or otherwise which germany has undertook over the years

and we are not even talking reparations at this point

 

we are talking that she should should equally bare the same cross that she is demanding that greece take on her shoulders alone, and stop busting  pontius pilate "i wash my hands"  moves

 

I dont understand what exactly greece wants

 

you see .... the problem is not so much what greece wants....but what greece NEEDS

 

so i suggest you seriously consider removing those beloved horse blinkers that so many in germany, especially in the banking fraternity soooo love to wear

 

what it needs? aye...that is the multi-trillion dollar question

 

 i have said it before ...repeatedly... and i will say it again .... greece needs to first of all get her finger out of her arse and start implementing major changes, ... in her mindset, her policies, her decapitation and blithering bureaucracy and many more

 

but above all else she needs help, GENUINE help ... and time to implement those changes, assuming that the government in power, whatever it is, and no matter what its political orientation it might be, actually strives toward that destination

 

And what we get in return?

do i really need to answer that ? seriously? for it sounds awfully like you talk as if a money lender quite happy lend to gamblers and compulsive shoppers else ...they beak their legs

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Guest eyoismos

Calm down guys. Mistakes have been done on both sides. Both Greece and the EU are in a situation now where a viable solution needs to be found. Time is running out.

Either way, even if Greece exits Euro I don't think this is going to be the end of Greece or the end of the EU.

 

Greece has find herself in tougher situations than this. We'll somehow find a way to make this work.

 

 

actually i am being quite calm ... and all i am trying to point out EXACTLY what you said , or rather what you imply .... that BOTH sides need to get their shit together

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Guest PatrickT

Germany got "its shit" together. With all respect but there are not many countries on that plamet as powerful and rich as we are.

 

what greece needs are structural reforms. Reforms which we demand since day one. But which are still not implemented.

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