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anti german hate in greece hits unknown levels

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admin:

 

If the world wants to believe and pledge allegiance to kings and queens and gods, who am I to break their bubble?

Their Bubble?

 

You did pledge to be faithful and bear true allegiance to Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth II, Queen of Canada when you took the oath of citizenship. Now you are talking about THEM and THEIR bubble? Are you not within the same bubble?

 

Is an oath just lip service then?

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These types of oaths? Sure they are. They're remnants of times when people's lives "belonged" to kings and queens. Is any of this relevant in today's day and age? 

Oaths are made by people who are afraid that their power will, at some point, be challenged. Like kings and queens, military leaders, dictators and so on.

 

An oath is not the same things as your word to an individual whom you know and respect. Is your oath to respect and obey your military leaders while in the Greek army as powerful (and relevant) as your word to a buddy of yours to help him build a fence or repair his house or whatever?

 

Oaths are enforced to you (and to the average individual) by those in power and by the power of the groupthink. They don't mean anything to most people anymore, yet we still take those oaths as we still eat lamb for easter and turkey for Christmas.

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admin:

 

An oath is not the same things as your word to an individual whom you know and respect. Is your oath to respect and obey your military leaders while in the Greek army as powerful (and relevant) as your word to a buddy of yours to help him build a fence or repair his house or whatever?

Absolutely. The life of my buddy does not depend on a fence being build today or next month. The life of my brothers in arms though does depend on me doing my duty just as my life depends on them being true to their oath. I'm out of service age now but when I took my oath I was fully aware that I would have to execute every order given regardless of my liking it or not. And I was not forced to serve and take the oath. It was my choice.

 

In an other thread we were talking about challenges to the territorial integrity of Greece. So what would you say to the soldiers who one day may be called up to defend it? That their soldiers oath is irrelevant?

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In a grander scheme, yes. I personally don't believe in borders and national territories. This world should belong to every human being who lives on this earth and we should all be free to travel anywhere in the world without having to worry about borders and nationalities. To me saying I'm a Greek national or a Canadian national doesn't mean anything. I'm Greek because culturally I associate myself with the Greek culture.

 

Of course I also understand today's reality and I understand that the majority of people is not ready to accept a global community without borders. Thankfully I live in a society (Canada) which is the closest we've ever been to multiculturalism. Eventually the rest of the countries will have to learn, adapt and accept this reality.

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Guest eyoismos

So you are a Zambian national by birth. Why do you get all worked up when I call you that?

 

oh it must be wonderful living in a world of absolute b&w ...while you conveniently forget what you ALSO said ...something about living where i do and throwing my lot in and all the rest ...

 

And NO I've not taken an oath of alligiance to become a Greek Citizen because I was born in Greece to parents who were also born there.

I tοοκ an oath when I did my (greatly reduced) millitary service though

 

 

Ορκίζομαι να φυλάττω πίστιν εις την Πατρίδα.

Υπακοήν εις το Σύνταγμα, τους Νόμους και τα Ψηφίσματα του Κράτους.

Υποταγήν εις τους ανωτέρους μου,

να εκτελώ προθύμως και άνευ αντιλογίας τας διαταγας των.

Να υπερασπίζω, με πίστιν και αφοσίωσιν,

μέχρι της τελευταίας ρανίδος του αίματός μου, τας Σημαίας.

Να μην τας εγκαταλείπω, μηδέ να αποχωρίζομαι ποτέ απ'αυτών.

Να φυλάττω δε ακριβώς τους Στρατιωτικούς Νόμους,

και να διάγω εν γένει ως πιστός και φιλότιμος Στρατιώτης.

 

how amusing ... that you make an issue taking youre oath seriously  .... while you mention something about greeks and ...what was it you said?.... something about "apparently the sad norm in Greece" , implying that greeks dont  ..but in the mean time ... what is it you also said ? .. something about hating greece perhaps, .... or perhaps ... a certain affinity , even affection towards being a proud turk .... and somewhere about something about that we should be ruled by turks....... all the while swearing allegiance to the flag with the price being your blood ..and coming back full circle about taking the oath seriously ...as opposed to greeks...right? :P

 

i reckon you have a great time playing on the swings and round-abouts , going to and fro, and round and round , in your personal back yard of believes and principles

:P

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Guest eyoismos

In a grander scheme, yes. I personally don't believe in borders and national territories. This world should belong to every human being who lives on this earth and we should all be free to travel anywhere in the world without having to worry about borders and nationalities. To me saying I'm a Greek national or a Canadian national doesn't mean anything. I'm Greek because culturally I associate myself with the Greek culture.

 

Of course I also understand today's reality and I understand that the majority of people is not ready to accept a global community without borders. Thankfully I live in a society (Canada) which is the closest we've ever been to multiculturalism. Eventually the rest of the countries will have to learn, adapt and accept this reality.

multiculturalism is a myth ...and one only realizes this when you are suddenly faced with a situation whereby you are surrounded by another culture which is alien to your own , in your own country or residence, everybody bubbling away in some random language, and i mean everybody around you, in a place where one took years even to learn the local dominant language, only to realize WTF! am i in the same country still?  ...ditto in the case of when the roles are reversed ...and we are certainly not talking about "fresh of the boaters" ...or a shit load of illegals ... either ---

 

prime examples ... being woken up every morning at the crack of dawn, or even way before that, by some muezzin calling for prayer, with damn loud speakers no less, let alone 5 times a fucking day , every day ... or some arsehole property owner causing a lot of noise about the restaurant owner selling pork gyro, even subtly blackmailing the said restauranteur desist or get the fuck out - because the smell offends him and infecting his property ...thus forcing the guy to sell only chicken gyro  - and no ... i am not talking shit either -

 

by the way ... is it "politically correct" to talk about "merry christmas" in canada? and that is but another example ... i bet many embrace "Happy holidays" instead , because now "happy christmas" has become a political statement .... so canada has replaced one religion with another .. Wal-Martianity..... so much for multiculturalism

 

as one article i read, said ...

Multiculturalism in Canada has allowed cultures to grow and flourish but it has not created channels of communication between cultures. It has never really encouraged ethnic minorities to experience and learn about other cultures in a meaningful way.The multicultural policy to me deals almost exclusively to the preservation of one’s culture but does not address the real issue of social and economic inclusiveness.

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eyo:

 

oh it must be wonderful living in a world of absolute b&w ...while you conveniently forget what you ALSO said ...something about living where i do and throwing my lot in and all the rest ...

I didn't say anything about black and white. I've only acknowledged that you are a Zambian National by birth. Regardless of what else you may be. Does that upset you? If so you must be having issues with your national affiliation.

 

I say I'm an ethnic Pontian with Greek Nationality who has lived in Germany, US, Spain... and you call me a whore. And yet I remain a Greek citizen, have sworn an oath to defend the Greek Republic and never pledged aligiance to any other nation. And yet I am the whore. Says the Zambian who demands voting rights in Greece.

 

And yes you are right. I hate pretty much everything about Greece and yet I served and took an oath to defend it. I don't have to like it to do that. Is that so difficult to understand?

 

Guess what,

I also have a brother who, I think, is a complete asshole. I don't like anything about him and yet growing up I jumped into every brawl he got himself in. Come hell or high water I will always stand by my brothers side no matter how much he pisses me off.

 

eyo:

 

i reckon you have a great time playing on the swings and round-abouts , going to and fro, and round and round , in your personal back yard of believes and principles

I suppose you are not a principled man. Everything is a matter of convinience to you and yet you have the nerve to call me a whore.

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Eyo, you're describing issues arising because of religious differences, not because of cultural differences. Granted of course than in many cases religion is part of a people's cultural identity. Since most religions are so rigid they make it impossible for certain people to live in peace next to each other (see for example Jews and Palestinians).

 

Saying this though, Jews and Palestinians live fine next to each other within a multicultural society (in Canada for example). 

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Eyo, you're describing issues arising because of religious differences, not because of cultural differences. Granted of course than in many cases religion is part of a people's cultural identity. Since most religions are so rigid they make it impossible for certain people to live in peace next to each other (see for example Jews and Palestinians).

 

Saying this though, Jews and Palestinians live fine next to each other within a multicultural society (in Canada for example).

Well Admin,

 

Invite a couple of Muslim, Jewish and Hindu friends over and serve beef wrapped in bacon and smothered in butter. Don't forget to have a few beers on ice. Enjoy!

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Guest eyoismos

Well Admin,

 

Invite a couple of Muslim, Jewish and Hindu friends over and serve beef wrapped in bacon and smothered in butter. Don't forget to have a few beers on ice. Enjoy!

 

close enough  .... what many cant comprehend is that religion is very much part ofanybody's culture, including those who no religious affiliations at all

 

but one would have to be a complete arsehole to pull a move like the above, and quite confrontational to

 

what wolud be appropriate is if one accommodates others, but by the same token the others, should they dare damn well pull any shit and they would deserve what is due to them  - problem is  quite often they do

 

http://www.news.com.au/national/parents-say-son-was-tormented-for-eating-salami-sandwich-during-ramadan/story-e6frfkvr-1225797140592

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Guest eyoismos

I didn't say anything about black and white. I've only acknowledged that you are a Zambian National by birth. Regardless of what else you may be. Does that upset you? If so you must be having issues with your national affiliation.

 

I say I'm an ethnic Pontian with Greek Nationality who has lived in Germany, US, Spain... and you call me a whore. And yet I remain a Greek citizen, have sworn an oath to defend the Greek Republic and never pledged aligiance to any other nation. And yet I am the whore. Says the Zambian who demands voting rights in Greece.

 

And yes you are right. I hate pretty much everything about Greece and yet I served and took an oath to defend it. I don't have to like it to do that. Is that so difficult to understand?

 

Guess what,

I also have a brother who, I think, is a complete asshole. I don't like anything about him and yet growing up I jumped into every brawl he got himself in. Come hell or high water I will always stand by my brothers side no matter how much he pisses me off.

 

 

I suppose you are not a principled man. Everything is a matter of convinience to you and yet you have the nerve to call me a whore.

dont you love it when you made wild conclusions and not taking time lines into consideration

 

first you said

 

 

That's right. I don't know what your ethnicity is but your Nationality is Zambian.

You chose to live there. You chose to throw your lot in with the Zambians.

So yes. You are Zambian.

 

then i said

 

 

 

oh i get it . you chose to live in germany and you chose to throw your lot in with the germans, therefore you where a german

ditto when you did what you did wherever else you immigrated, presumably for reasons of "the bucks"

and now you chose to live in america and you now have thrown your lot with the americans, therefore you are now a yankee

 

sounds awfully like a bit of a whore

 

OR you havent quite got what defines nationality

 

:P

 

αλλά μου φαίνεται καμιά φορα .... όποιος έχει ψύλους ψυριάζεται ..... thus getting all high and mighty about me calling you a whore

 

only then i disclosed that i am zambian by birth, and pointed out that your whole premise was flawed

 

its THEN AND ONLY THEN did you acknowledged me being zambian by birth and blow all to do with  your original assumption

 

so your whole post above  is a non entity, thus null and void

 

and for the record . .. i dont root for a vote in greece, as much as representation of the diaspora, via votes for the diaspora,  in greek parliament - certainly not to be able to vote for bought and sold greek political parties ... and i mean it just like the french and italians do, representation  .... thus MASSIVE difference

 

so again .... your attempted "dig" is a non entity too, and just as null and void

 

 

 

 

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Well Admin,

 

Invite a couple of Muslim, Jewish and Hindu friends over and serve beef wrapped in bacon and smothered in butter. Don't forget to have a few beers on ice. Enjoy!

 

As I said, these are all related to religious beliefs. I do have a few Palestinian, Lebanese, Iranian, Afghani and Jewish friends who do eat beef, pork, seafood, you name it. Oh yes, they also drink alcohol and smoke too. We've had many a nights where we ate, drank and had a few cigars too. There's nothing in these people's cultures that stops them from enjoying all this. It's religion which places this type of stupid rules.

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eyo:

 

OR you havent quite got what defines nationality

I know very well what nationality means and how it differs from ethnicity but you seem to confuse the two. I am a Greek national of Pontian ethnicity and there are Greek nationals who are ethnic Pomaks, Turks or Romani. Just as there are Zambian nationals of various ethnicities. That's all there is to it and I really don't understand why you get worked up about it.

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Guest eyoismos

I know very well what nationality means and how it differs from ethnicity but you seem to confuse the two. I am a Greek national of Pontian ethnicity and there are Greek nationals who are ethnic Pomaks, Turks or Romani. Just as there are Zambian nationals of various ethnicities. That's all there is to it and I really don't understand why you get worked up about it.

 

oh my!

 

pray tell  how many more ways must i point out that your original premise about nationality is highly flawed. there is no confusion at all, and worked up i am not

 

seriously  .... time to take a chill pill, because as usual you are jumping again to wild conclusions....

 

here is a question for you

 

what would  you say the bulk of cypriots are, ethnicity wise, ....at least how they see themselves?

(assuming that they manage to unite the island as the cypriots themselves seem to desire, thus thinking of them as one nationality)

 

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Guest eyoismos

Admin,

 

I don't think Canada is a multi cultural society. In fact I don't think the term multi-cultural has any meaning since we live in an almost entirely culture free world.

oh wow ... now we live in an "almost entirely culture free world" ?

 

that sounds almost ridiculous at first look.

please explain yourself and expand on that statement,

 

 i mean sure, there are bound to be some common areas that might have developed, over the years of recent history,  mainly due to lets call them cross experiences in this modern world of travel and communication.... but culture free?

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eyo:

 

what would you say the bulk of cypriots are, ethnicity wise, ....at least how they see themselves?

And how would you formulate the question in Greek?

 

Ποια είναι η εθνικότητά σου;

... Η Κυπριακή.

Ιθαγένεια;

... Κυπριακή.

Υπηκοότητα;

... Κυπριακή.

 

Do you see the problem here? Εθνικότητα can be taken to mean Nationality or Ethnicity. Sure there have been attempts to clarify the definitions in official use but the term remains ambiguous in a conversational context. Which has of course much to do with the shifting definition of Nation and National Identity in a multi ethnic high mobility environment.

 

You could of course substitute the term Εθνικότητα with more narrow Εθνότητα and if you are lucky and your conversation partner understands the difference chances are he/she will answer Ελληνική or Τουρκική.

 

I would love to elaborate on why I think we live in a Culture Free world but that would require a whole essay on what constitutes Culture.

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