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Guest NickTheGreek

Would you support a return to the Megali Idea as well as a more nationalistic Greece?

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Guest eyoismos

and while we are at it ... another interesting observation ... when the europeans where screwing up the greek economy with their antics and policies ... most here ... it was the greeks fault

 

 

but when then did ..and do .. in africa ..... its the european colonialist fault ...never the africans

 

and we wont even mention the concept of ... at the hight of slavery ... the europeans wherent exactly going off marauding for "raw materials" to send to the americas ...... they where all relying on their suppliers .... Africans themselves who had a beef with opposing tribes  .... and let us not forget the whole rwanda thing with the Hutu and Tutsi  .... and everybody was bitching that the europeans/americans didnt get involved to save the genocide from happening ..... yet strangely not a word about why the chinese didnt get involved either ..... while eveybody forgets ... or ignores ... the chinese didnt get involved for the same reason that the europeans didnt .... no raw materials worth scavenging over

 

which makes some of you here full of shite

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eyo:

 

what comes to mind immediately is those fanatic burst arshole muslim ISIS extremists and the capacity to blow up their own heritages  like temples and artifacts from ancient history

 

Here you go again with the western superiority complex which compels you to tell "Them" what their heritage is and how to deal with it. You are of course entitled to your personal opinion, and I agree that what they are doing is stupid, but we are in no place to either condone nor condemn their actions. What they do with their own real-estate is none of our business. It is theirs and theirs alone to do with it as they please.

 

 

Which can not be said in the case of French Catholic Abbe Fourmont. That guy, funded by French Catholics, made it his life's mission to travel from France all the way to Laconia, hire Laconian peasants, and have them dig up, break to pieces, and dump into the sea, all that remained of ancient Sparta. He writes:

 

 

For a month now, despite illness, I have been engaged with thirty

workmen in the entire destruction of Sparta; not a day passes but I find

something, and on some I have found up to twenty inscriptions. You

understand, Monsieur, with what great joy, and with what fatigue, I

have recovered such a great quantity of marbles. . ..

 

 

If by overturning its walls and temples, if by not leaving one stone

on another in the smallest of its sacella, its place will be unknown in

the future, I at least have something by which to recognise it, and that

is something. I have only this means to render my voyage in the Morea

illustrious, which otherwise would have been entirely useless, which

would have suited neither France, nor me.

 

 

If you think ISIS are Barbarians for breaking some stones in their backyard, then how do you describe France that produced Abbe Fourmont and many others like him?

 

You'll say that was then and now "WE WESTERNERS" know better but was there ever a time when Judeo-Christians didn't know better?

 

And since Novo-Graecians are counted among the westerners lets consider my namesake and patron saint of the Novo-Graecian Navy.

Saint Nicholas.

 

agios-nikolaos.jpg

 

His greatest achievement, for which he was elevated to sainthood, was the destruction of the Temple of Artemis. And here we are, centuries later, celebrating every 6th of December the destroyer of one of the 7 wonders of the ancient world as a saint while condemning ISIS for doing their business in their domain. Don't you see the hypocrisy in this?

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Guest eyoismos

 

Here you go again with the western superiority complex which compels you to tell "Them" what their heritage is and how to deal with it.

 

"western superiority complex" ? really ? is that the best crap you can come up with? next you will be telling us that isis represents the huge majority of iraqees and syrians and that their right to blow their antiquities of their past ..and i mean of iraq , or syria for that matter ...

 

next you will be claiming that the whole muslim world supports isis

 

 

the above just tells anybody how full of shit you are ... and your propensity to come up with outrageous claims based out even more outrageously borderline propaganda crap passing off as facts

 

but then i suppose its "western superiority complex" that has egyptians passionately if fanatically  proud of their glorious pre-muslim past, their Pharaohs, their pyramids, their achievements .... their .... oh why bother ... when one talks bull like so often you do , and talks completely out of context ...just so you can exhibit your own inferiority complexes , but pointing out the faults of others in such a big way, in an attmpt to hide the forest from the trees and make the water thick as mud

 

 

and while we are  at it .. st nick had fuckall to do with the distruction of the temple of artemis  ... the first time it was destroyed by floods, the 2nd by arson, the 3rd by marauding invading goths .  that whole thing about st nick doing the dirty is just one of the many myths that have been dreamed up ...by people like yourself, ...but way way way in the past .... for their own specific propaganda purposes and intents to sway common opinion  (as opposed to reality and fact) so people like yourself believing that crap of so called st nick and his sins as fact ....

 

... the side of the fence might be different ... but the methods of manipulation is EXACTLY the same

or to paraphrase .... a snake by any other name is still a snake

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Guest eyoismos

oh ... and before i forget ... i wonderfull little book on amazon about the frenchie

 

The Forgeries of the Abbe Fourmont. The 18th century forger who specialized in producing ancient Greek inscriptions, etc

 

https://www.amazon.com/forgeries-Abbe-Fourmont-R-Christie/dp/B01AGVUHZK

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Yes. Western superiority complex. Why is it any of your business what ISIS does in their own land? They represent Islam and the people who live in the region. It is the support of those people who keeps them around against the efforts of western "Saviors". If the locals dont feel represented by ISIS it is up to them to chase them away. Or are you suggesting that they wont be able to do it without the aid of the Anglo-Franco-American Superman?

 

As far as the St. Nick story is concerned. I didn't make it up. The story is so popular in Orthodox Christianity that they even made it into a graphic novel.

 

270974.jpg

agios+Nikolaos-Lydia.jpg

270975.jpg

 

If you find it offensive complain to your Orthodox Church that publishes this kind of Christian manga. Don't go on about ISIS which is none of your business. If you want to criticise "Barbarism" start with the Greek Church for her habit to glorify "Barbarian" saints.

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Guest FriendofGreece

i see the title of the major categories of the quoted  World bulletin and i see .....

 

world - Turkey - Economy - Islamic World - Hajj ..... and all the other standard stuff

 

 

draw your own conclusions about alleged accuracy non-bias and all the rest coming from that website

 

 

This is what the Global Research (Wordbulletin) website says about itself:

 

http://www.globalresearch.ca/about

 

Mind you, I think the readers of this forum are intelligent enough to read different point of views and draw their own conclusions. I myself never rely on only one source of information. If anyone is interested, they can always make more research and bring into the discussion. Out of lack of time, nobody can spend time to check everything. That's what a forum is for, for discussion. 

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Guest FriendofGreece

but by the same token all those "smart" americans , civilian and military, wherever they have invaded ...to bring democracy ...  stole a shot load of artifacts top take home as souveneirs ... let alone trade with certain "museums"

 

 

Don't worry, Americans steal artefacts from other countries too. If you read the book on the Buddhist artefacts on the Silk Road, you will see that they were all there looting and destroying ... Americans, Germans, British, French, Russians, etc. I have not been to museums in the US but there must be plenty of looted artefacts there too.

 

 

and while we are at it ... another interesting observation ... when the europeans where screwing up the greek economy with their antics and policies ... most here ... it was the greeks fault

 

 

I have always been the staunchest defender of the Greeks and Greece against the Europeans' treatment.

 

As for the Greek artefacts, it is a shame that they were stolen and destroyed by whoever is involved. Greece must continue, with other countries, to apply international pressure, one way or the other, to get back the Parthenon marbles and much more artefacts that are scattered around the world, i.e. Europe and North America. Thing is those artefacts are not only in museums but also in private collections which we do not see.

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Guest FriendofGreece

This is a very good review of the book "Foreign devils on the Silk Road":

 

 

The book is truly excellent to read and made a big impact on me, especially at the end where the author said that the stash of Buddhist scriptures that they took from the Buddhist monk was left in the basement of the British museum somewhere for years, still in the boxes in which they were shipped to the UK, unopened and unread. One can wonder what for they stole those, especially considering the British are Christian, maybe just for the resale value? 

 

When I have time, I am going to read the book again, although I remember I was utterly upset by those "Foreign devils" who destroyed the Buddhist paintings in the caves. Highly recommended.

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Guest eyoismos

 

If you find it offensive complain to your Orthodox Church that publishes this kind of Christian manga. Don't go on about ISIS which is none of your business. If you want to criticise "Barbarism" start with the Greek Church for her habit to glorify "Barbarian" saints.

 

and yet you perpetuate it AS IF it was true ... which makes you a fool

 

and i dont find it offensive ... i find it amusing ... the perfect way to put some tossers in this part of the world ... including the religiously blinded,   in their places giving them a massive taste of humility awakening, while eating crow  ... remember once ... one person in particular got all ass bent when i pointed out the krifo scholeio was a myth created for propaganda purposes ...etc etc etc ... that person is STILL pissed off and refuses to believe the facts

 

but in the mean time i dont perpetuate myths as true ...unlike some others ...we wont mention names

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Guest eyoismos

as for ISIS bashing ... the stuff they destroyed does not belong to them ... but to the people of that region,  many  of which, because of the war, booked out to the four winds.... that DOES NOT mean they dont have those artifacts as their heritage .... not to mention that islam was not even a twinkle in muhammed's eye let alone aything else when those said artifacts wher created, hih makes them of world heritage worth let alone the syrians, etc etc etc

 

so excuse me while i continue to bash those wanker murdering bastard banshee religious whores still living in the dark ages....and you can keep riding your holier than though horse of world non-reality

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Your cognitive abilities amaze me!

 

What exactly is a Myth?

The FACT that Christianity destroyed Hellenic Monuments?

 

And who exactly is perpetuating the myth?

I, by drawing attention to Christian Manga where the Orthodox church boasts of that achievement?

 

I suppose Kostis Stephanopoulos was perpetuating the myth too when he, as the only Greek official to date, suggested the Anathemas against the Greeks be removed from Orthodox liturgy. To no avail of course. The average Novo-Graecian pretends to overhear them and instead accuses those who point it out of perpetuating "Myths".

 

Well, that's how Greeks are and that's why I enjoy seeing this shitty little country and her abhorrent people go down the crapper.

Learn Turkish, you'll need it soon enough.

 

 

btw. The ISIS guys are the people of that region and do as they please with their stuff. I haven't seen any Syrians get worked up about Palmyra but if it is that important to YOU, send your kids to fight and protect it.

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Guest cyprusellas

Would you as a Native Greek or Greek-American (or any nationality) support the idea of the Megali Idea and conquer what was historically Ancient Greek land. For example retaking Constantinople and Western Turkey and reclaiming the rest of Cyprus. Would you also support the rebuilding of Greek infrastructure and Ancient Monuments, such as the the Colossus of Rhodes, Parthenon, and Statue of Zeus to instill a greater sense of nationality in Greece. My third question is whether or not you would support the reclaiming of our own history from the Former Yugoslavic Republic of Macedonia, who shamelessly stole Alexander The Great as their own and built monuments to him and his father in their Skopje. As a Greek-American I'm fully behind these ideas and believe we should carry them out and restore Greece as a dominant world nation once we fix our economy, by leaving the European Union and bringing back the Greek Drachma. We were once the pinnacle of human civilization and our day will come again, I'm sure of it. However I doubt any of this can be carried out under our current corrupt government and I would suggest a revolution and model the constitution off of America which I believe is one of the best written governments to date. i'm curious if other Greeks agree with any of this and believe in it like I do. America got blessed with Donald Trump, it's time Greece had hers.

I'm in favour of having that done. Im very patriotic myself and I find it difficult to come by fellow Greeks who are. I feel our roots and culture are being lost. I started a topic called declining as a race and so far only 2 people have contributed.

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I'm in favour of having that done. Im very patriotic myself and I find it difficult to come by fellow Greeks who are. I feel our roots and culture are being lost. I started a topic called declining as a race and so far only 2 people have contributed.

 

You must be out of your freaking mind!

Have you ever been to Istanbul? There are over 15 mil people in the city. More than 20 mil in the surrounding area (aka eastern Thrace and the adjacent Kocaeli province). In case you don't know, Greece has around 10 mil people. Lets set ethics aside and look at the Megali Idea from a purely technical vantage point: It is technically impossible.

 

But even if it were possible to conquer, lets say the area around Istanbul, how would that play out in your head?

Field Marshal Panos Kamenos leads our glorious troops to Konstantinople, Patriarch Bartholomew crowns Alexis the 1st emperor of the Neo-Byzantine empire and the faithful sing "Τη υπερμάχω στρατηγώ τα νικητήρια" in the Hagia Sophia while 20 mil Turks cower in fear or flee to the rest of Turkey?

Dream on....

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This seems to be a fantasy of many Greeks outside Greece, and also a fantasy of the Golden Dawn boys. They don't worry about the logistics or about the absurdity of this claim. On top of this, it's the same people who want Greece to leave the EU  :rolleyes:

So think about this for a minute. A Greece outside the EU, isolated, without any strong allies behind her, having to deal with a bully on the other side of the border. I wonder how this would play out for us...

 

The stupidy of some of my fellow Greeks doesn't stop to amaze me.

 

In the meantime we have more pressing issues to deal with. We have to deal with a completely incompetent government which has destroyed whatever the previous incompetent governments had left standing. A Greece more or less destroyed financially and its people demoralized and hopeless. It's going to be an impossible task to get this Greece out of this tough situation. I really can't see how this is going to happen.

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Guest cyprusellas

 

You must be out of your freaking mind!

Have you ever been to Istanbul? There are over 15 mil people in the city. More than 20 mil in the surrounding area (aka eastern Thrace and the adjacent Kocaeli province). In case you don't know, Greece has around 10 mil people. Lets set ethics aside and look at the Megali Idea from a purely technical vantage point: It is technically impossible.

 

But even if it were possible to conquer, lets say the area around Istanbul, how would that play out in your head?

Field Marshal Panos Kamenos leads our glorious troops to Konstantinople, Patriarch Bartholomew crowns Alexis the 1st emperor of the Neo-Byzantine empire and the faithful sing "Τη υπερμάχω στρατηγώ τα νικητήρια" in the Hagia Sophia while 20 mil Turks cower in fear or flee to the rest of Turkey?

Dream on....

Im not! I'm not saying thats going to happen but im all for us Greeks to be united, your not patriotic at all we've established this when you said you dont care about Greece and if they have nothing to offer you then theres no point in my that other topic. you migh aswell change your identity

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Guest cyprusellas

This seems to be a fantasy of many Greeks outside Greece, and also a fantasy of the Golden Dawn boys. They don't worry about the logistics or about the absurdity of this claim. On top of this, it's the same people who want Greece to leave the EU  :rolleyes:

So think about this for a minute. A Greece outside the EU, isolated, without any strong allies behind her, having to deal with a bully on the other side of the border. I wonder how this would play out for us...

 

The stupidy of some of my fellow Greeks doesn't stop to amaze me.

 

In the meantime we have more pressing issues to deal with. We have to deal with a completely incompetent government which has destroyed whatever the previous incompetent governments had left standing. A Greece more or less destroyed financially and its people demoralized and hopeless. It's going to be an impossible task to get this Greece out of this tough situation. I really can't see how this is going to happen.

I dont see how being outside of the EU will result in no allies. The european parliament will cease to exist you Greeks who believe by staying in Europe we're safe dream on!, this seems to be a trend amongst non-patriotic,liberal non-religious Greeks. 

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Im not! I'm not saying thats going to happen but im all for us Greeks to be united, your not patriotic at all we've established this when you said you dont care about Greece and if they have nothing to offer you then theres no point in my that other topic. you migh aswell change your identity

You are a complete dumb ass. You are so patriotic that you can't bother to install Greek language support on your computer. Can't speak decent Greek and don't have any skin in the game. You are right. I'm not what YOU call a patriot. I didn't had to watch 300 to discover Greece.

 

I have my house and my fields in Greece. Pay taxes, light and water bills there. I have other worries. Don't have time for cheap 300-type patriotism. I can't take clowns like you serious.

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Calm down ajax. I'm sure that cyprushellas' love for everything Greek/Cypriot comes from a good place. I know that many Greek/Cypriot who were born and live outside Greece feel in a similar way. They have idealized Greece/Cyprus. Some of them were raised listening to stories of loss from their parents or grandparents and they maintain a skewed idea of today's reality.

 

Reality is that Greece is not only in a dire financial situation. It's in a dire situation period. We have to deal with a monstrous public sector, health care is crumbling, social programs are non-existent, unemployment is at an all-time high, birth rates are low, we have to deal with "unfriendly" neighbors on all borders etc. Dreaming of "reconquering" lost lands is not only unrealistic, it's idiotic. This is not the 1900s anymore. We're living in a different world. We have to adjust to this reality and make the best out of the situation. There are much more pressing issues that Greece has to resolve in order to improve the lives of its people than picking fights with the Turks.

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Calm down ajax. I'm sure that cyprushellas' love for everything Greek/Cypriot comes from a good place. I know that many Greek/Cypriot who were born and live outside Greece feel in a similar way. They have idealized Greece/Cyprus. Some of them were raised listening to stories of loss from their parents or grandparents and they maintain a skewed idea of today's reality.

 

Reality is that Greece is not only in a dire financial situation. It's in a dire situation period. We have to deal with a monstrous public sector, health care is crumbling, social programs are non-existent, unemployment is at an all-time high, birth rates are low, we have to deal with "unfriendly" neighbors on all borders etc. Dreaming of "reconquering" lost lands is not only unrealistic, it's idiotic. This is not the 1900s anymore. We're living in a different world. We have to adjust to this reality and make the best out of the situation. There are much more pressing issues that Greece has to resolve in order to improve the lives of its people than picking fights with the Turks.

My sincere apologies CyprusHellas. I should have paused and considered that you mean well before responding harshly.

 

However, dreaming about conquering a neighboring country 8 times as populous as ours while we are in the midst of a rapid demographic, economic, cultural and moral decline doesn't solve any of our problems. Actionable ideas and practical initiatives are needed. Unfortunately, no one, me included, seems able to offer those.

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Guest cyprusellas

You are a complete dumb ass. You are so patriotic that you can't bother to install Greek language support on your computer. Can't speak decent Greek and don't have any skin in the game. You are right. I'm not what YOU call a patriot. I didn't had to watch 300 to discover Greece.

 

I have my house and my fields in Greece. Pay taxes, light and water bills there. I have other worries. Don't have time for cheap 300-type patriotism. I can't take clowns like you serious.

why does it bother someone who doesnt care about his country whether I have installed a software package where it allows me to type in Greek? but yet your the one who doesnt even like his own mother land! 

 

you are such a hypocrite one minute you say you dont like Greece and its backwards thinking people but the next your mentioning about your house and land in Greece what a loser, you either love your country or hate it make up your mind you retard! Like I said before I can speak read and write Greek if that wasnt the case I wouldnt of understood what you said before in that other topic.

 

Furthermore for someone who is so anti Greek your on a Greek diaspora site haha what a joke 

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Guest cyprusellas

My sincere apologies CyprusHellas. I should have paused and considered that you mean well before responding harshly.

 

However, dreaming about conquering a neighboring country 8 times as populous as ours while we are in the midst of a rapid demographic, economic, cultural and moral decline doesn't solve any of our problems. Actionable ideas and practical initiatives are needed. Unfortunately, no one, me included, seems able to offer those.

My dearest ajaxmonkey I to apologise for you not understanding what I wrote, I never once said we were or are going to something try and attempt to take back our lands, I pretty much said that I would love for that to happen :) and there 8 times our populous because they breed like rabbits maybe we should of taken note of this many years ago before our recession

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Guest cyprusellas

Calm down ajax. I'm sure that cyprushellas' love for everything Greek/Cypriot comes from a good place. I know that many Greek/Cypriot who were born and live outside Greece feel in a similar way. They have idealized Greece/Cyprus. Some of them were raised listening to stories of loss from their parents or grandparents and they maintain a skewed idea of today's reality.

 

Reality is that Greece is not only in a dire financial situation. It's in a dire situation period. We have to deal with a monstrous public sector, health care is crumbling, social programs are non-existent, unemployment is at an all-time high, birth rates are low, we have to deal with "unfriendly" neighbors on all borders etc. Dreaming of "reconquering" lost lands is not only unrealistic, it's idiotic. This is not the 1900s anymore. We're living in a different world. We have to adjust to this reality and make the best out of the situation. There are much more pressing issues that Greece has to resolve in order to improve the lives of its people than picking fights with the Turks.

It comes from my love for My Cyprus Greece and its Island I love anything and everything Greek. It hasn't got so much to do with loss as many countries once upon a time had more land mass than they do now due to wars etc. But they seem to have moved on from such troubles with their neighbours which is very good, however when you have turkey violationg airspace, sea and threatening Greeks and Cypriots on a daily basis it makes it extremely difficult to not be patriotic and wish for our lands back! I think thats fair to say. I dont think you or ajax seem to understand that living in England surrounded by turks, kurds and albanians who hate  Greeks has in turn made me someone who holds different views

 

as I said before I never once said we should recapture our lands I merely said I would love for us to have our lands back

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Patriotism is for idiots and let me explain why:

 

There are three abortions, paid for by the public health care system, for each live birth in Greece.Those numbers where from the late 90's way before the economic crisis.

I don't deny women their right to choose. I only mention this because, in the age of contraceptives, this becomes an indicator for how stupid and irresponsible Greeks actually are. Are the Turks to blame for the fact that we Greeks are dying off at a, rapidly accelerating, rate of 30.000 a year?

 

My mother pays for our house an amount close to 4 times the value of the Electricity we actually use. Despite of that the Greek Electricity company is on the verge of bankruptcy. They are unable to repay 200 mil in loans while they are being owed 2.8 bil by their 1.5 mil customers who just refuse to pay.

Are the Turks to blame? NO. Tsipras wanted to get the "Δεν πληρώνω" vote so he enacted a law that forces ΔΕΗ to provide electricity to over a million people who haven't paid in years.

 

The Greek banks are cash strapped even though they are owed 60 bil by borrowers who just refuse to pay even a symbolic amount. Once again thanks to Syriza enacting laws to satisfy the "Δεν πληρώνω" camp. Who is to blame for that? The Turks?

 

Once you get involved with Greek reality you will understand that patriotism is for the Μαλάκες. I at least feel like one for paying my obligations in Greece in full and on time while my neighbors bought their "Μεζονέτα" with a loan they now refuse to repay. As a result of their refusal a quarter mil of my money is trapped in a Greek bank and I can not transfer it out even though I could use it to expand my business right now. So I'm sorry but I realy don't care about the Turks "violating" some airspace Greece claims as her own. A claim that no one in the world recognizes btw.

 

Patriotism is of course a great tool for politicians. Beating the patriotic drum distracts from their failures and allows the profiteers to continue to profit while the Μαλάκες look up to the clouds for those Turkish jet fighters and other threats to the motherland.

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